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Post by Fran on Jan 26, 2006 21:56:14 GMT -5
if u click on google news about elizabeth, you'll just find mediocre articles about her being ridiculous in "Showgirls" and in everything. I guess that some people who calls SHOWGIRLS the worst movie in the world haven't seen it. It's just the cool thing to say.
Now there's this article about the "ressurection" of Woody Allen and you read "...the director allowed for the abysmal performances of Dan Aykroyd and Elizabeth Berkley to make the final cut of Curse of the Jade Scorpion..."
WHY PEOPLE STILL TALK S*** ABOUT HER??? WHY PEOPLE IS SO LAME, WHY JOURNALISTS ARE SO ANNOYING AND IMMATURE??? What's wrong with Elizabeth Berkley?
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Post by zach86 on Jan 26, 2006 22:20:20 GMT -5
People have nothing better to do but to hate on other actors and actresses. Don't let it bother you though. If you learn to just accept the fact that there is always going to be people out there that have something negative to say about someone else, then it will be easier to deal with their criticism.
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Post by Barb on Jan 26, 2006 23:23:08 GMT -5
Yeah, I wouldn't let it bother you. There's always some actor or actress that somebody doesn't like...I don't know why they don't like her. Maybe they're really jealous and they haven't admitted it. lol  But yeah, don't let it bother you. What's important is that you, and many others, love Elizabeth. ;D |
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Post by QueenKelly on Feb 2, 2006 16:25:50 GMT -5
Fran, just calm down.  Do what I do and just ignore it. I can understand you being so upset, but those people don't care about that. Infact, they say this stuff to get a rise out of Elizabeth's fans. Don't let it get to you. There are actors and actresses out there that just annoy me beyond belief and I can't stand them, but I would rather spend my time talking about the ones that I really enjoy and talk about how much I like their work. Those other people just don't have anything better to do with their time. There is NOTHING wrong with Elizabeth Berkley! ;D ;D ;D |
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Post by Fran on Feb 2, 2006 20:12:40 GMT -5
well i'm not actually NERVOUS about that. Quite calm, yes. But the bad thing is that all the bad rumors had affected her career: her last movie was done in early 2003 and even if she did 3 successful plays in Broadway since then, I'm pretty sure they're in part responsible for that. But hey, i know... ELIZABETH HAS NOTHING WRONG! |
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Post by QueenKelly on Feb 3, 2006 16:52:51 GMT -5
Fran, if people are not going to want to watch Elizabeth because of things that critics and other idiots are saying about her, then those people just can't think for themselves.
Elizabeth did a flop for a movie in 1995. If people are going to focus their attention on that 1 project and ignore all the work she has done since then, the hell with them. I have seen so much of Elizabeth's work and even other celebs have seen her work and stand up for her! Goldie Hawn helped her get the small part in "The First Wives Club" and Faye Dunaway has been their for her.
The real fans know how much talent she has and will continue to watch her work.
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Post by The Animal on Feb 3, 2006 20:09:14 GMT -5
So what you're saying is that Showgirls is NOT a bad movie?
I don't care who starred in what role, that movie was beyond horrendous.
Regarding her recent roles, she's done nothing worthwhile to give her any "honorable mentions". She hasn't starred in any major roles since the Showgirls flop and has been relegated to bit parts. Whether her acting is good or bad is not the point. She's never had any breakout roles that would distinguish her from outside the SBTB circle. Let's face it: generally speaking, the only people who really know who she even is are SBTB fans.
However, not to pick on just Berkeley, the same can be said for the rest of the cast members, with the exception of Mark-Paul Gosselaar. So far, he's the only one that has been able to "break the mold" as being from SBTB. Mario Lopez, no matter how many pet shows he does or how many mediocre talk shows he hosts, he'll be known as "the guy from SBTB" until he has a break-out. Lark Voorhies has done NOTHING since SBTB, and at this rate, may never get the chance to be a major star.
This is not to flame Berkeley's acting ability, but the lack of star power has earned her the criticism she's been receiving. Then again, it may have been the horrible performance in Showgirls that has prevented her from getting the chance to break out of that role.
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Post by Fran on Feb 3, 2006 22:41:35 GMT -5
I didn't mean that the audience response to SHOWGIRLS affected her career or rumors people have about her. What affected her career was the fact she did "Showgirls" and hey, sorry if we don't think the same, but "Showgirls" is not the horrible movie people love to say and her peroformance was not at all the worst perofrmoance of the year like poeple keep saying. It's just that US is conservative and "Showgirls" was too much european and opena about sex than other movies. I know the movies has flaws, sure it has, bad dialogues, bad screenplay, but people took it too much seroiusly and the real point is that "Showgirls" was more a farse, a joke about Las Vegas and that kind of world. About the reaction in USA, that's true if you see the reaction OUTSIDE United States. Italy, for example, is very religious and the Chruch power is stronge, but "Showgirls" was took for what it is. A not great movie. Not worse than others. The same happened in Spain, in Germany, in UK. We're culturally more open than US people about sex. So a lot of people HATED, really HATED the movie and HATED ELIZABETH because she was the lead. Yes, it was a big risk, she took it. The film flopped. It's her fault? She deserves to be called a mean-puppet on a stick? She deserves to be nomianted "the worst actress of the century"? She deserves all that for starring in a movie? What about that fact, as she pointed, that at 20, she entered a room and left with the lead in a Paul Verhoenven's movie? Verhoeven, a relaly talented director, saw talent in her. Woody Allen too. Stone too..
She's not the best actress in the world. I know. She's not Meryl Streep. But the immature thing is that you can destroy a film career just because of a big mistake.
You said "she's done nothing worthwhile to give her any "honorable mentions". What more you can do when directors won't even want you to audition for them just bacuse you did "Showgirls"? i'0m not defending her just because i like her. Is that all the thing is really unfair. Com on, people on the street called her "sleeper"!
Do you think is mature for a journalsit, wrote about her: "A clothed Berkley"? Please!
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Post by QueenKelly on Feb 4, 2006 0:41:01 GMT -5
Animal, I respect your opinions, but I'm with Fran on this one. You said that the only people that know of Elizabeth are those that saw her on SBTB? Do you happen to know everyone in the universe to verify that?
As far as the rest of the cast goes, yes they will always in some way be identified with the show, but if your saying that Mark-Paul is the only one that has come out successfull, you obviously haven't followed the careers of the rest of the cast.
I guess in the U.S entertainment industry, you don't deserve any credit unless you're on a top TV show or block buster movie. Has it occured to you that perhaps Elizabeth is very content where she is right now? She's happily married and doing lower budget films and guest spots on popular TV shows. How do you know she is not content with that right now?
Mark-Paul is on a great high as far as his career and personal life go, but the only reason I feel you mentioned him is because he is on a ground breaking drama that is doing very well. Once again, the U.S way of measuring success.
And Tiffani! Did a great job on 90210, unfortunetly didn't succeed with Fastlane, but was hand picked by Woody Allen for Hollywood Ending. She is now having the time of her life taking her short film Just Pray, which she directed, to film festivals, which has won awards and is still being featured at film festivals one of which was Robert DeNiro's Tribeca Film festival. Ever heard of him? While this is going on she was also basking in the glory of planning her wedding to her now husband artist Brady Smith.
Mario has had his successes and his down falls, but I still believe that he will succeed. He did SBTB, TV movies, enjoyable cop drama Pacific Blue, Pet Star, which I believe was very popular.
Dustin was and I thinking is still working on his stand up comedy, but after the tragedy his wife suffered with her pregnancy, right now they are both concentrating on helping children in need through his foundation.
I haven't heard anything about Lark, but that just may be because she has chosen to leave the spotlight. I do know that she is a religious person, so maybe she has found work that is more meaningful to her. I actually do believe she has done some lower budget projects that she has every reason to be proud of. I know one off hand is Civil Brand. I'd have to check my scrap book for more about her and Mario's projects. I do have them updated to 2003.
So Animal, as you can see I prefer to do my research before I pretty much call all but 1 cast member from a TV show "failures" in their careers. I know you didn't use the word failure in your post, but that's what I get from it.
Fran I think Italy and Canada are the same when it comes to the entertainment industry. There are so many talented Canadian actors that won't seek work in the U.S because they are so content with all the work they get here and know they don't need a hit show or a blockbuster for their Canadian fans to just adore them and appreciate their talent.
Just to make sure everybody knows, I'm strictly refering to the U.S entertainment industry and the small handful of people that feel the way Animal does. I do enjoy many U.S TV shows and Movies, but they don't have to be hit shows or blockbusters for me to enjoy them and I truly believe the majority of people feel the same way.
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Post by The Animal on Feb 4, 2006 1:12:58 GMT -5
Did I say anything about their careers being considered failures? No.
Did I even hint at the notion that that cast members are not happy where they are? No.
They are just not the mainstream actors that people on here want them to be, Gosselaar being the ONLY exception. True, I forgot about Thiessen in 90210, and her performance in that show have her enough to break out of the "SBTB mold". None of the others, though. None of the others have had breakout roles for the public media to garner them such publicity.
Fact: Showgirls was a HORRIBLE movie. Doesn't matter who starred in it or how they acted. The numbers prove it. The movie was a total flop, which equals disastrous reviews. Until Berkeley can come off a great review in some kind of feature film or TV show, she won't be able to escape that frame of mind. Oh yeah, and playing a hooker in Any Given Sunday didn't help much either.
I am not calling her or any other cast member's careers "failures". What I am saying, however, is with the exceptions of Gosselaar and Thiessen, not one of them has had a breakout role. While their personal lives are all good and fine, the fact is they will be known generally as their last famous work. If Gosselaar's performance in Commander-in-Cheif flops, then he'll be known as "that guy from NYPD Blue". Until Berkeley outdoes her work in Showgirls, that is what she will be known as.
I didn't say you or anyone else don't enjoy their performances. I am just saying that their performances have not reached the gold standard that most would like to admit.
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Post by Barb on Feb 4, 2006 1:28:14 GMT -5
Here's my view on the cast.
Elizabeth...looks like she enjoys the theater. If that's important to her then that would be a success. Just because you're not in the top movies doesn't make you a bad actor. I've only seen parts of Showgirls, so I can't give an opinion. I don't think her work on there is going to give her a bad reputation in the acting business. It was the movie, not her. I think being Jessica Spano did. She has carried her SBTB image. She's done a lot of guest spots lately...and she's obviously coming back. We'll definitely see a lot more of her.
Mario...I think he is having a tough time, but he still had a great run on The Other Half. That show was very popular. He's got a movie coming out...he'll be fine.
Mark-Paul...well, we all know he's had one successful drama and is now on another.
Tiffani...90210. Several top notch guest spots. A few movies. Always at several appearances. Maybe she enjoys being different characters instead of one character? Maybe not. Either way, I find her successful.
Lark...I don't know what to think with her. Her and her husband own a production company. Maybe she enjoys working behind the camera.
Dustin...I think he's exploring his options. He's done quite a few different things in the past few years. We'll see in time. I could never take him seriously in a role, I know that. And I will always see him as Screech. Now he's the actor I feel for in the cast.
Either way, we all have our ideas of success. I think they've all accomplished some sort of success.
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Post by QueenKelly on Feb 4, 2006 8:54:26 GMT -5
Barb, I couldn't agree with you more. Elizabeth has had success since Showgirls. If she hadn't, we would never hear about her. She has done alot of low budget films and I think very successful guest appearances. She has made it since Showgirls!
I also agree that I don't see Dustin as any other character but Screech, but I don't think he has much interest in being an actor anymore. I think he really wants to be a stand-up comedian.
Animal, the entire cast is always going to be known for the SBTB no matter how successful they are. But since I'm assuming you haven't seen many interviews with them, Elizabeth has happily embraced the show just like Tiffani has. Mark-Paul had a harder time because between 1994 and 2000 he could hardly get work because of the show, but now he embraces it.
The good actors like John Travolta all embrace their past work from 20 years ago.
There is nothing wrong with the SBTB cast being known for their roles, but fans are seeing them in a different light as well. from your first post I do feel that you are saying that aside from Mark-Paul, they have accomplished nothing in their careers. You may not have meant that, but that's what I get from it.
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Post by The Animal on Feb 4, 2006 12:18:46 GMT -5
You're missing the point. It's nice you know all their life stories and feel compelled to share them with us to prove that their careers can be measured by some level of success. This was not the intent of this post and/or thread. The thread started as to why Elizabeth Berkeley is still known as "the lead in Showgirls" when she has had other roles since then. The answer, which was met with cast filmographies for some reason, is the point I'm trying to get. Elizabeth Berkeley has not done anything famous (or infamous, in the case of Showgirls) since then to break out of that reputation. While some may consider her career a success, she will be known as "the lead in Showgirls" until she has some kind of break-out role that cancels it out, or, unfortunately, comes out with an even worse movie. The odds of either happening are... well, I'm not a betting man.
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Post by Barb on Feb 4, 2006 12:46:12 GMT -5
I mentioned cast "filmographies" because you mentioned that you didn't think most of the actors had done anything well-known since SBTB. I was just thinking about what they've done.
I agree that Elizabeth hasn't done anything well-known in movies/tv recently. But in my opinion, she's still successful. That's two entirely different points I'm trying to make. My opinion on success is different than yours, as well as everyone else. I still see her as successful because she's doing well-known tv shows for guest spots and she's doing theater, which she loves. BUT I do agree with you when you say that most people are going to remember her from SBTB and Showgirls...because those are the last couple huge things that have been talked about.
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Post by QueenKelly on Feb 4, 2006 14:39:12 GMT -5
Animal, Barb pretty much just said what I was going to say about the achievments of the other cast members. I do know what this thread is about. I respect your opinions on this thread, although I don't agree with them.
Let's say that Elizabeth gets a huge part in a film and the film is a blockbuster success. That does not mean that her work on SBTB or her flop Showgirls will no longer be mentioned. She will be complimented for that blockbuster, but I don't believe that she will be able to do a sit down interview in which SBTB and Showgirls won't be mentioned anymore.
I just want to make sure you understand, I really wanted to make this clear to you, that I know you did not call the other cast members "failures". I specifically said to you in my one post that I felt that is what you were saying without using the word.
We have a difference of opinion on this issue, but that doesn't mean that I don't respect your opinion. I'm actually really enjoying this conversation and please remeber that I respect your opinions.
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But yeah, don't let it bother you. What's important is that you, and many others, love Elizabeth. ;D
Do what I do and just ignore it. I can understand you being so upset, but those people don't care about that. Infact, they say this stuff to get a rise out of Elizabeth's fans. Don't let it get to you. 
